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All the Perl that's Practical to Extract and Report

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  • You seem to be pissed off because I rejected a badly-written patch of yours about a pointless new keyword, and now you're going at war. What's your point in spreading all this FUD really ? Bring Perl 5 to an end ? Make me quit P5P ?

    And seriously are you really believing all this nonsense you're writing about releasing ?

    • Thank you for finally responding directly to me.

      You seem to be pissed off...

      I'm not angry. I'm sad.

      ... because I rejected a badly-written patch of yours about a pointless new keyword....

      Even after all of the complaints about people who talk more than they code, I don't expect standing ovations for producing code, but I would appreciate at least an acknowledgement that I did something about it.

      This is the first time (to my knowledge) you've made any comment about the implementation of the patch. If you

      • Lies and plain lies. I already commented on your patch on P5P. Several [mpe.mpg.de] times [mpe.mpg.de]. But you probably choose to ignore any opinion that's not in line with your ideology?

        There is a plan for 5.12, see for example here [mpe.mpg.de] which is a recent statement of intention. Concerning fixing release dates, I consider that pointless [blogspot.com] and I don't understand why you think release dates matter.

        Also, I don't like at all the way you systemically mischaracterise 5.10 by spreading FUD -- yes, I'm using the word again -- about how it would

        • gnore any opinion that's not in line with your ideology?

          There is a plan for 5.12, see for example here [mpe.mpg.de] which is a recent statement of intention.

          A "statement of intention" is not a "release plan".

          Concerning fixing release dates, I consider that pointless [blogspot.com] and I don't understand why you think release dates matter.

          Can you honestly say that the overly long release date have helped Perl? I think not but I would like to hear why you think it hasn't.

          Sorry, but I can't take you seriously anymore

          That is really sad. You are now dismissing him so that anything he says, whether good or bad, you don't have to worry about. I am glad we as Perlers are easily dismissive. That sure helps the dialog.

        • But you probably choose to ignore any opinion that's not in line with your ideology?

          I chose the word implementation deliberately, Rafael. I'm a careful writer. You're a careful reader.

          I don't like at all the way you systemically mischaracterise 5.10 by spreading FUD...

          The quote in the linked message was an analogy. To my recollection, I have never suggested that all new features in Perl 5 require use feature, only that some new features do. As I have written many times, my concern is that this is th

        • Raphael, I've been a long-time reader of both your blogs and chromatic's. You seem to basically characterize anyone who agrees with chromatic as 'less experienced'. That's a bit insulting. You can count me as one of your former readers now. And that makes me more sad than angry.
          • Being less experienced in technical and open source project management issues than Rafael is a very broad statement and certainly not an insult. I consider myself part of that group yet I've been around longer than most.

            • It's one thing to present it like it's a fact (I'm in the same group as you, actually more so). However, it's quite another to use it as a defense of one's tenuous arguments, and as a way of disregarding the opposing view. To me, painting everyone who agrees with chromatic as such falls into the latter, and indicates the person making the argument is unwilling to listen and unreasonable to deal with.

  • > Yet I believe I never devolve to name-calling, strawmen arguments, nor misquoting people. (If I do, please tell me and I'll correct it.)

    Personally, I'd say you have a tendency towards hyperbole. I've found when putting forward arguments the responses counter a far more extreme version of what I've actually said.

    That may have a more correct name than hyperbole...

    As for the DarkPAN argument, that seems at risk of being a kind of software development form of Loki's Wager [wikipedia.org] (with a measure of Appeal to Ridic [wikipedia.org]

    • That may have a more correct name than hyperbole...

      Discussions on the Internet tend to veer quickly away from the excluded middle.

  • > I can predict the day and date of Parrot releases into the next century.

    BTW, there's your hyperbole.

    I really would leave that point alone. One can predict all sorts of things, but who's to say they'll be true. Your prediction, should you actually do it, requires that you'd found a way to guarantee the accuracy of releases, to the day, after you are deceased.

    Also, there's nothing at stake. Now of course, if you were to specify a series of exact release days and dates stretching out for the next several

    • Also, there's nothing at stake.

      It's software. There's very little at stake anyway.

      Of course there are conditions to the prediction: Parrot must be a maintained project in 100 years and the current release strategy must remain (at least for the twice-a-year supported releases).

      Would you feel more comfortable if I predicted the dates of the next twenty four releases? We've hit our target dates within 24 hours for the last thirty or so releases; that's an easy prediction to make.

      • That would be great.

        Care to place a wager on whether or not you'll hit them all?

        • That would be great.

          Care to place a wager on whether or not you'll hit them all?

          That's not the point, at least in my perspective. With Parrot and Rakudo there is a consistent plan in place that indicates when the next release is made, pretty much to the day. I believe there has been one slip in Rakudo's release schedule of a few days (announced ahead of time).

          In stark contrast, the same thing cannot be said about perl 5.10.1, 5.12, etc. At this point I couldn't state with any certainty what the intended release data for any of those are to within a year (that fix for the performance