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All the Perl that's Practical to Extract and Report

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Oz: How not to teach a language 7 Comments More | Login | Reply /

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  • Don't you think a lot of that is probably frustration due to being unfamiliar with how things are done in this new environment?

    It does look interesting at first glance, in any case. Thanks for the pointer.

    • Being forced to use EMacs is not "a new environment", it's having religion imposed on you.

      Any language that forces you to use a particular editor needs to die a slow and painful death.

    • It does look interesting at first glance, in any case.
      Well, just looking at the Hello World program, I see nothing at all that even remotely peeks my interest. It looks like just more of the same old cruft.

      Perhaps the rest of the language is more interesting, but I don't see any of that here.
      • You don't want Oz as a general purpose language. Its no good at that. You want it because it has nice ergonomics for constraint solving, parallelizing execution across computers, or perhaps something about it being a data-flow driven language.

        Perl isn't good at any of those. I don't know ofa nice thunking layer between Perl and Oz so maybe I'd want to just use Perl's glue-language capabilities to write Oz code and scrape the output as it came back.

        I'm a rank Oz novice though.
        • I don't know what being a data-flow driven language buys you, fwiw. Lazy execution, sure. Whether that's something to make me want to move code into Oz or not... I have no idea why I'd do that right now.

  • As much as I hate to say it, I'm glad you didn't go with AI::Prolog. Scheduling problems (as with any search algorithm) are generally heavily recursive and AI::Prolog probably would have killed any hope you had of having a fast system.

  • For what its worth, I write Oz in Emacs but don't use the integrated thing much. I do have X handy which is nice for those popups though. There's also printing stuff to STDOUT if you've no X.

    A compile -> run command looks like this:

    ozc -c program.oz && ozengine program.ozf

    A compile -> debug command looks like this and it requires a GUI. The debugger mostly sucks though.

    ozc -g -c program.oz && ozd program.ozf

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