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All the Perl that's Practical to Extract and Report

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Perl6 site...really...I give up 8 Comments More | Login | Reply /

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  • The source code for the site is available. Commit access is easy to get. If you have a better design, nothing stands in the way of your improvements.

    • About ten years of lost progress stand in the way of improvements. Need I list the number of programming languages that came and went in that time?

      Thankfully I am not paying for any of the group developing perl 6, I would be pretty annoyed if that were the case.

      I can fix the webpage, sure. I cannot, however, fix the last 10 years of perl 6 debacle.

      • I cannot, however, fix the last 10 years of perl 6 debacle.

        So do you have anything useful to say, or are you just saying "GODDAMN THAT SUCKS WAH WAH WAH YOU ALL ARE DOODOOHEADS FOR WORKING ON IT," because really that's about all I'm seeing.

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        xoa

        • Let me spell it out for you: drop this insane perl 6 thing immediately. Give us good, stable threading in perl 5 instead of self-hosting grammars in perl 6. Et cetera. We are your user base. Or used to be... - ank
          • drop this insane perl 6 thing immediately. Give us good, stable threading in perl 5 instead of self-hosting grammars in perl 6.

            See, now that's something we can address, if a bit obnoxious.

            Here's what you're missing: Perl 6 and "good stable threading in perl 5" are not mutually exclusive. It's not as if the people working on Perl 6 would necessarily working on your pet projects. Fact is, Perl 6 is not at all a distraction from Perl 5. If anything, it's feeding Perl 5.

            If you want improved threading i

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            xoa

            • Let me insist: trying to build Perl 6 is less useful to real, practical perl than actually working on Perl 5. If you think proper OO syntax, multithreading, better speed, etc are "pet projects" of mine, then we really have nothing more to discuss, since I believe those are major issues in perl 5 that should have priority over perl 6 work. You can't expect me to believe that the perl 6 team can't work on that.

              Also, I think the point which is lost is that the users aren't clamoring for a "lexically overridea

              • ...since I believe those are major issues in perl 5 that should have priority over perl 6 work. You can't expect me to believe that the perl 6 team can't work on that.

                You seem to be operating from an assumption that most of us working on Perl 6 would instead be spending our time and energy on Perl 5 if Perl 6 didn't exist. The question is not whether we can work on Perl 5 major issues, the question is whether we'd be motivated to do so.

                I know that this assumption is not true in my case -- if I wasn't working on Perl 6 I'd probably be out finding a $real_job somewhere, or working on some other new project not directly related to Perl development. It's very unlikely I'd find myself wanting to contribute to the Perl 5 core. This isn't at all intended to imply that I think that Perl 5 shouldn't be worked on; it's just that Perl 5 development requires different kinds of time, energy, and motivation investments that wouldn't bring me any real personal satisfaction.

                Both Perl 5 and Perl 6 are volunteer-driven efforts, with very different sets of attractions for the people that self-choose to work on them. The problems (and opportunities) that exist in the Perl 5 domain are very different from the ones in the Perl 6 domain, and so they attract different sorts of volunteers. There's no "boss" that can force us to work on priorities that don't match our own -- it's all self-selection.

                So although I hesitate to speak for others, I have the strong impression that if Perl 6 ceased tomorrow that very few of "the Perl 6 team" would suddenly decide to be working on difficult Perl 5 issues instead. I think that like me, most of us would just pick entirely different (non-Perl development) challenges altogether.

                To be clear, I still love Perl 5. I'm very excited by the work being done by Enlightened Perl, Modern Perl, and the like. I think these are incredibly worthwhile efforts and have only praise for the people undertaking them. But the tasks involved in Perl 5 development don't appear to be things that motivate me (and others like me) to want to work on them.

                Let me insist: trying to build Perl 6 is less useful to real, practical perl than actually working on Perl 5.

                This may or may not be true, but it's completely beside the point. For me, it's not a question of whether my time and energy would be better spent working on Perl 5, it's whether there's anything about Perl that makes me want to work on it more than the many other (non-Perl) projects I could be doing instead. I'm not motivated by the idea of volunteering my personal time and energy solving challenging Perl 5 issues. I am motivated by the idea of building Perl 6.

                Pm

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