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All the Perl that's Practical to Extract and Report

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  • Ingy, you live simply because you can. Others have families or don't want to live in tree houses. If those who want to devote lots of time to Perl 6 find out that they have to feed their kids instead, the community's poorer for it. Right now it looks like we'll lose Leo and he's been a huge force behind Perl 6 work. That's gonna hurt.

    If you find that getting paid for open source work doesn't work for you, that's fine, but doesn't mean others are in such a luxurious position. Personally, I feel Damian

    • I didn't mean to offend anyone, but then again I didn't try hard not to either. =)

      At the risk of being more offensive, let me state further what clearly is only my opinion.

      I'm not so sure that it is going to "hurt" to "lose" Leo. Hurt. What does that mean anyway? And are we really "losing" him? He's not dying. He just chose to invest a lot of his time doing something which I imagine was immensely satisfying. And he probably ran out of funds and needs to feed his family. That's OK. He should do that. He can always come back. His credit and karma are very good afaict.

      Should we give him money to keep working on this now? I can't answer that. I probably won't give money. You are welcome to obviously. What will happen if we don't? I'll bet that the World will keep turning. The Perl World even.

      My main point is that there isn't a required timeline on Perl6. If it is a good idea it will happen. If it is a bad idea it should die sooner than later. I happen to think it is a very promising idea.

      Is Parrot a good idea? I'm not as sure. It was a brand new thing, of gigantic scope, started entirely from scratch, by a handful of very ambitious folks. On paper it seemed quite foolish, but who in this community can say "No" to a fellow ambitious hacker. I would never rain on that parade. But that doesn't mean I would endorse funding building a dome stadium over it. Granted I'm from Seattle, so I'm a little jaded about building dome stadiums at the taxpayers expense. We have two. And I'm pretty used to rain.

      You are right to say that I "can" live simply. I got lucky because I didn't have kids when I started this. I don't think I could be involved at a deep level with young kids. And my point is that there are very few who can. That's OK.

      As to Damian, everything you mention he did while getting paid, he was doing even moreso before he got paid. I thought the cool thing about funding Damian was the press it generated, "Hey look at those Perl folks, they have a Hired Mad Genius working for them. That's so cool!"

      If I knew of a way that everyone who contributed to our community could live happily ever after, I'd be all for it. But here's the real world facts:

      1) You are going to die.
      2) You need to eat or you will die sooner.
      3) You need to figure out your own way to obtain food.
      4) Nobody owes you anything.
      5) Life is better when you are happy.
      6) If coding makes you happy and you live in a free country and can afford access to a computer, then you are free to code.
      7) Good luck.

      I'm not against a foundation set up to make life easier, but as an Open Source Project Manager, I personally don't endorse it as the best method to success.
      • I am completely at a loss to understand how your list of real world facts relates to the issue at hand. It seems to me that the issue is: the Perl Foundation would like to fund some developers. You seem to be arguing against funding. Just because it doesn't work for you doesn't mean that it doesn't work. I have absolutely no problem with you saying you don't want to donate. You've contributed plenty in many other ways and I and others appreciate that, but I just don't understand why you're trying to d

      • But is it the one true way to get to the end of the Journey?

        Nope. There's always more than one way to do it.

        My main point is that there isn't a required timeline on Perl6.

        Yup. Exactly. With various permutations and combinations, the various paths are basically:

        1. Development continues as it has. Developers come and go. Perl 6 is released.
        2. Some funding comes in. We use it to get a little more developer time. Perl 6 is released sooner.
        3. Companies hire Perl 6/Parrot developers, let them do open source