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NOTE: use Perl; is on undef hiatus. You can read content, but you can't post it. More info will be forthcoming forthcomingly.

All the Perl that's Practical to Extract and Report

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  • Part of the problem is trademark law. If you have a trademark, you have to control its use and you can't let just anyone use it for anything. You have to defend its use so it's actaully a mark of the trade that you do and not a generic mark that anyone uses. A trademark is used to distinguish what you do against what other people do. That's the point, and the law says that you have to do various things to defend your mark.

    Python, on the other hand, apparently isn't using their images as an actual trademark
    • You make a good point. I guess my question is, why does there need to be a Perl trademark in that way? What benefit does it provide to TPF and the wider Perl community?
      • The benefit to TPF is clear: they can mark officially supported projects as part of TPF. When you see the Onion logo, you know you are looking at something from the TPF. Thus, TPF controls how its reputation and perception are used.

        TPF has obvious benefit to the wider community, and them taking the completely reasonable and usual steps to protect their reputation and perception through their mark is normal business. As TPF conducts themselves with due diligence, they can be an effective organization and con
        • Heh. Well, I would prefer if someone officially associated with Perl were to do that, as grink commented, and give public use their blessing.

          I think a lot of people feel it's a pity that when a (great) logo finally appears for Perl, after years of the community having to piggyback on an O'Reilly trademark, that we're not actually allowed to use it. Good design unfortunately appears to be in short supply in the Perl world, for reasons I don't understand; perhaps because the lack of perceived "glamor" doesn

          • Why do you need a Perl person to design a logo? It wasn't a Perl person who came up with the camel logos (although Larry suggested the camel). It wasn't a Perl person who came out with the Perl Mongers logo, or the Perlcast logo, or the Catalyst logo. Why limit yourself to Perl people? Go hire a graphic designer.

            Why do you need a logo from anyone else to say that you use Perl? Why should you rely on anything that TPF does to help yourself? Plenty of stuff happens outside of TPF. It isn't the center of Perl.
            • TPF... isn't the center of Perl. It's just a foundation.

              Their website says [perlfoundation.org], "The Perl Foundation coordinates the efforts of numerous grass-roots Perl-based groups, including... perl.org... Carries the legal responsibility for Perl 5, Perl 6 and Parrot".

              Are you honestly telling me with a straight face that it isn't the center of Perl?

              Why limit yourself to Perl people? Go hire a graphic designer.

              I don't have the money to do that, and nor, I suspect, do most people. Which is exactly why it will almo

              • Yes, I'm telling you with a straight face the TPF is not the center of Perl. With everything that TPF does, it still is a minority of activity in Perl. This site is not part of TPF. The Perl Review and $foo magazine are not part of TPF. CPAN is not part of TPF. Catalyst and Moose are not part of TPF. TPF is not the community: it's about 10 people running a foundation.

                Why do you insist on an official community logo? Why should anyone control what anyone else does with Perl? I don't think TPF or anyone else s
                • TPF is not the community
                  I didn't say it was. I said it was the center of Perl. Administrative, financial, legal center.

                  Why do you insist on an official community logo?
                  Because it's guaranteed free publicity for Perl. Why else? Why are you arguing against one?

                  I suspect that our disagreement is that you think TPF should be responsible for everything and do everything for you, and I think that if people don't do things on their own, there is no community.
                  What a fantastic example of a straw man. I really couldn't do better.

                  If you don't care to do that little bit of work, and it really is that simple, then you don't care enough to keep arguing about it.
                  I'm sorry, but you can't force your opinion on someone in that way, as much as you'd like to.
                  • A logo isn't free publicity.

                    I'm not arguing against a logo. I'm arguing against anyone expecting someone else to give them what they want. If you want a logo, make it happen. I don't see that happening though. So, you'll continue to not have what you want.

                    I guess I can't force my opinion on you, but you still don't have what you want. It's not my fault you aren't doing anything to help yourself.
                    • A logo isn't free publicity.

                      A logo that people will proudly and widely display without fear of legal repercussions is exactly that.

                      you aren't doing anything to help yourself.

                      Let's look at that "little bit of work" you glibly refer to, then. Your assertion is that because I'm not

                      • finding suitable candidate designers,
                      • assessing their portfolios,
                      • putting an offer out to tender or otherwise soliciting and negotiating a design contract,
                      • drawing up and agreeing to said contract via telephone calls, email
                    • I don't know. Doesn't seem that hard to me and I've done it several times before. I don't think it's that much work. Your definition of "too much" might be different. You sure seem to have time to post here though, and that's taking away from your logo time.