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rafael (2125)

rafael
  rgarciasuarezNO@SPAMgmail.com
http://consttype.blogspot.com/

Journal of rafael (2125)

Friday April 11, 2003
11:23 AM

Ham and Bacon

[ #11600 ]
When I read stuff like this -- U.S. missionaries plan 'spiritual warfare' when fighting ends -- I'm just wondering : how can a christian honestly believe, if not blinded by ignorance and/or by faith, that he could convert a muslim, even in ideal conditions, (i.e. a friendly, open, muslim, not taking into account the weight of tradition) ? -- Islam is a more recent religion than Christianism, and Muhammad knew Christianism pretty well. He did prevent the christian objections to Islam since the very beginning. Muslims already acknowledge Jesus' miracles, his teachings being inspired by God, the virginity of the Virgin, etc. (and they find that asserting that Jesus died on a cross is rather blasphematory, how could you believe Allah would abandon one of his prophets like this, you infidels ? ;-) Actually the history shows much more examples (both ancient and recent) of christians converted to Islam, than the contrary (some of the higher saints of Islam were born christian).

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Ham and Bacon 12 Comments More | Login | Reply /

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  • Muhammad's knowledge of Christianity is quite in question. For one thing, the Qur'an incoporates apocryphal stories of Jesus from noncanonical sources that were circulating in his day. If his knowledge came from these sources, it was quite suspect. Also, the only representation of Christianity in his day was Catholicism, and one of the cornerstones of traditional Protestantism is that Catholicism was a prophesied departure [goreadthebible.com] from true Christianity.

    In particular, Muhammad was unable to understand the trin

    --
    J. David works really hard, has a passion for writing good software, and knows many of the world's best Perl programmers

    • And one thing I left out: the Biblical teaching is that the Gospel was God's final revelation and would not be changed. It was given "once for all [goreadthebible.com]," and condemnation is expressed [goreadthebible.com] against any who would come up with a replacement revelation. Of course, Muslims would say the Bible was corrupted since it was originally written. ;)

      --
      J. David works really hard, has a passion for writing good software, and knows many of the world's best Perl programmers

    • Muhammad's knowledge of Christianity is quite in question. For one thing, the Qur'an incoporates apocryphal stories of Jesus from noncanonical sources that were circulating in his day.

      It should be noted that a lot of these apocryphal sources are as ancient as anything in Orthodox Christianity. (I use "Orthodoxy" in the sense of post-Nicaean not necessarily e.g Greek Orthodox.) Christians often forget that the shape of their canon owes as much to political factors as spiritual ones. In fact some scholar

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      જલધર

    • Muhammad was unable to understand the trinity -- not surprising, as most of the christians he knew where monophysites, who reject the trinity. I don't think that Muhammad ever met a single catholic.

      I was under the impression that Muslims did believe the crucifixion occurred, and possibly the resurrection -- yes, that's true, but Muslims believe that a double of Jesus was actually crucified, while his body was taken on heaven by angels. IIRC.

    • ... one of the cornerstones of traditional Protestantism is that Catholicism was a prophesied departure from true Christianity.

      What is your definition of "traditional Protestantism"? I've been a Protestant all my life (my father is a fourth-generation Methodist minister), and know Protestants of many denominations, and you're the first I've heard talking about this "cornerstone". Is this one of those traditions that go back to the early 1900s, when the fundamentalists got started?

  • I like the presupposition that Islam is even a significantly different religion from Christianity. It all sounds like just more Eurasian yelling from here.
    • Agreed. From where I stand all three three are just sects of the same belief set.
      • Looking closely, Islam and Christianism appear to be very different religions, that evolved from different grounds, with different approaches to politics, art, science, and sexuality. Their core operating principle, however, is the same, but I'm reluctant to call this core a "belief set". As Nietzsche says [fns.org.uk], in his recognizable and vehement way : What was the only part of Christianity that Mohammed borrowed later on? Paul's invention, his device for establishing priestly tyranny and organizing the mob: the b
  • I'm just wondering : how can a christian honestly believe, if not blinded by ignorance and/or by faith, that he could convert a muslim, even in ideal conditions, (i.e. a friendly, open, muslim, not taking into account the weight of tradition) ?

    An honest Christian would recognize two things: one, that only God can change the heart of a man, and that no man converts another; two, that the last command of Christ before he went to heaven was to tell the world about Christ.

    It is not up to the Christian to con
  • or how a mistranslation [geocities.com] from hebrew to greek became a dogma [ewtn.com].
    • The alleged horns of Moses are quite amusing, too. That's what happens when you have so much faith in a text that you end up throwing away reason, logic and common sense.
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